The Rewatch Podcast

In this weeks episode of The Dawson's Creek Rewatch, Cory and Tom have a few false starts and sudden ends as they discuss of season 4 episodes 19 & 20, "Late" and "Promicide."

Late:

Written by: Jeffrey Stepakoff

Directed by: David Petrarca

Original airdate: April 25, 2001

Synopsis:

While Gail deals with several false pregnancy scares with several trips to the hospital, Joey wrestles with her own scare: the possibility that she may be pregnant. She tries to get in touch with Pacey but he is incommunicado as Deputy Doug has taken him off camping in order to help him get his bearings after his arrest, something Joey doesn’t know anything about. Gretchen reveals the truth to her, explaining that Pacey may not have much of a future unless everyone comes together and tries to make life easier for him. Joey says she can’t do that right now, explaining that she is late, leaving Gretchen to try and persuade her to take a pregnancy test to be sure.

Dawson and Gretchen end up talking about a magazine job that Gretchen has an interview for in Boston which would allow her to go to concerts, museums, and restaurants and detail them for the periodical. This comes as a shock to Dawson and the two begin to try and work out how they could potentially keep a relationship going while on two different coasts.

Elsewhere Jack shows up late to the youth center to help Tobey with the students there and tells Tobey to take off while he finishes up. Tobey leaves but ends up being assaulted by a couple of guys who were up to no good, who started causing trouble in the neighborhood. When Jack shows up to the center the next day, he is surprised to see that Tobey is not there and the kids are running wild. Later he goes to check in with Tobey but he won’t answer the door, claiming he’s sick. Jack eventually gets him to open the door and sees that Tobey has obviously been beaten up. Jack tries to persuade him to go to the cops, but Tobey refuses and kicks Jack out.

Back at the Leery’s, Grams is holding a baby naming party for Gail and the rest of their female circle, with all of them giving their ideas for names with Joey giving Gail Dawson’s necklace he had given her once, reasoning that his little brother or sister would probably love to wear it someday.

Mitch and Dawson bond as he explains to his son about how women and men differ in how they feel and love a baby, as well as giving some advice regarding Dawson’s situation with Gretchen.

Bessie meanwhile figures out that Joey is possibly pregnant and the two argue before Gail interrupts them with the news that she’s feeling contractions again and needs to get to the hospital.

Jack talks with Jen about the Tobey situation and while it seems as if Tobey doesn’t want help, Jen convinces him that he likely does and to do the right thing and step in, which he does by bringing a Capeside youth officer to help and make a report. The next day, Jack shows up to escort Tobey to the center, helping him to get back to life and realizing that the two of them are more alike than he had previously thought.

Gretchen and Dawson talk at the hospital about their relationship and Gretchen reveals that while she did want to have sex on the beach during their trip, it just wasn’t the right time and that she is leery of getting closer to him when it is clear they are moving in different directions now.

After the labor was ruled a false pregnancy again, Joey goes to talk with Gretchen who advises her to make amends with Bessie because she will need a support system if she is pregnant, and reveals the story of her own miscarriage. Joey in turn advises Gretchen that despite her and Dawson moving to different sides of the country, that she should not just give up, as Dawson is the type of guy that would do anything for her, and to cherish that about him.

Joey and Bessie have a heart to heart the next morning and work out their issues, with Bessie telling her she is there for her, and hands her a pregnancy test. Joey takes the said test and is elated to find out that she isn’t pregnant. Pacey does end up finally getting in touch with Joey but during their conversation he hides the fact that he was drunk and arrested.

Gail once again heads to the hospital and while there, Joey and Dawson talk, with Dawson telling her to be sure to talk with Pacey about the future soon because it has a peculiar way of becoming the present way too fast, while Joey advises Dawson on his Gretchen dilemma, explaining that sex doesn’t necessarily bring people closer, but instead magnifying what is already present in a relationship. She reasons that he and Gretchen are likely a lot closer than many people who have sex. Their talk is interrupted however with the news that Dawson’s new baby sister has been born and everyone goes in to see the newly named Lillian Leery, taking the name from Joey’s mother.

When Dawson returns home, he finds Gretchen waiting for him rather than away at her interview, who reasons that there is always a later train she can take. They both proclaim that there’s no hope for them and should just break up as they pull each other close and kiss.

Dawson's Trivia:

David Marshall Grant was the officer. He’s been in many TV movies at the top of the supporting cast list, many times. Movies include Through The Eyes of A Killer with MacGyver himself Richard Dean Anderson (a woman attracts dangerous men, this time a killer), Three Wishes (woman helps an injured homeless man and he has an affect on her life), Air America with Robert Downey Jr and Mel Gibson (a young pilot is recruited unwillingly to help an older pilot in a corrupt CIA operation), and Night Sins with Valerie Bertinelli and Harry Hamlin (a woman investigates the abduction of a boy which leads to knowledge of more abductions). He was also in Mel Gibson’s Forever Young as an army officer. He was more of a lead in Legs (the story of women auditioning for the chorus line of the Rockettes), and Sessions (a call girl examining her life). He’s written ten (out of 63) episodes of a show called A Million Little Things (a friend dies but inspires his group of friends to do more with their lives), and 8 episodes (out of 47) of a show called Code Black (also acted in one episode).

I don't think I ever realised that the pendant on Dawson's necklace was flat, I always figured it was rounded. This episode shows it quite clearly-

Promicide:

Written by: Maggie Friedman

Directed by: Jason Moore

Original airdate: May 2, 2001

Synopsis:

As everyone gets ready for the upcoming prom, Pacey is more irritable than usual, noting that he wasn’t allowed to buy the prom tickets because of his low academic status and reassures Joey that he is taking care of the rest of the arrangements. Joey confides in Jen that lately Pacey hasn’t seemed to want to touch her at all, despite her even coming on to him.

Meanwhile Jack, Tobey, and Jen are hanging out and having a great time. After Tobey leaves Jen pushes Jack to consider taking Tobey to the prom, but he balks at that suggestion, leaving Jen to pull an old fashioned sitcom trope out of her hat and trick Tobey into thinking Jack wants to go with him. It works out ok as Jack is fine with going with Tobey but then warns Jen that he has something planned for her for prom as well. Much to Jen’s chagrin, Jack turns the trope around on her and Drue shows up at her door and accepts HER invite to go to the prom with her.

Meanwhile Gretchen receives bad news about her magazine job; she was passed over for it due to not having a college degree and experience. Despite this and her misgivings about going to the prom, considering she is four years older since her own prom was held, she still wishes to make the night memorable for Dawson so she sucks it up and decides to go.

Jack shows up to pick Tobey up and is taken aback at how good he actually looks dressed up and the two head off to meet everyone else at Dawson’s. As everyone gathers at Dawson’s for the prom, Pacey shows up with the flowers for the girls, but since he was never told to refrigerate them, they end up wilting away. Luckily Gail offers flowers from her garden to make up for it. Further disappointment is soon to be had however as the limo that Pacey arranged for shows up and it turns out to be a very rundown airport limo which is decidedly less luxurious than they were all expecting.

On the way, the group stops at a mini mart to grab some things they need for the evening while Pacey stays in the car with Jen. She reveals she brought along multiple mini bottles of alcohol in order to not only get through the night as Drue’s date, but for other things on her mind as well.

As the night goes on and the group mingles around the prom, Jack and Tobey get closer as Jack realizes that they do have a lot in common, and quite enjoys his company. However when Tobey asks to dance, Jack balks and tries to claim this is only a platonic date, leaving Tobey to leave the room, hurt.

Elsewhere Joey confronts Pacey but he refuses to say what is on his mind, claiming he is fine, but the two end up arguing and going their separate ways. She runs into Dawson and they talk and have a heartfelt moment together and decide to share a dance.

Elsewhere Pacey confides in Gretchen that he is angry with Joey but can’t figure out why, ever since he got out of jail and went on the camping trip with Doug. Gretchen herself feels like she is stuck, too old to be going to prom and not sure what is next for her in life. As they head back to respective romances, they find Dawson and Joey dancing, leaving Pacey to feel inadequate yet again as he cuts loose on Joey, asking her why she is even with him, revealing that he feels like a charity case that Joey took on to make herself feel better. Despite Joey trying to explain that she doesn’t care about Pacey’s mistakes, he shouts back at her that he wishes she WOULD care about his mistakes. As Pacey boils over, Joey leaves him, telling him to go to hell.

Elsewhere Jen is getting flat out drunk, but Drue tries to stop her, taking away her alcohol. She proceeds to climb out on the railing of the boat and actually ends up falling towards the water before Drue is able to save her and pull her back aboard. Jen admits she really does not want to go to school in New York, wishing to move ahead and not look back at her old city stomping grounds.

Jack and Tobey come to an understanding that Jack actually does indeed like Tobey and is ready to move forward with him as they finally kiss.

Gretchen talks with Dawson and tells him that she believes he is still chasing after Joey, that there is still too much for them to resolve, leaving her to break it off with Dawson, claiming they are at two very different points in their lives and in an impossible situation that she doesn’t wish to try and cope with.

Pacey talks to Joey and reveals that he feels they are on two different paths now whereas Joey is looking to get out of Capeside, Pacey feels that he IS Capeside and is destined to end up here forever. He tells Joey that she deserves better but she rejects that argument as they all drive back home in the limo quietly.

Dawson's Trivia:

Director Jason Moore got his start here on DC, and went on to direct on the shows One Tree Hill, Everwood, and Brothers & Sisters. More recently, he directed the movie Pitch Perfect and produced the 2 sequels, and also directed Sisters, starring Tina Fey and Amy Pohler. He’s also directed for the stage, starting off-Broadway but then moving to Broadway with shows such as the revival of Steel Magnolias, and Shrek The Musical. He’s just finished production on an Archie movie (titled just Archie); it seems to have no connection to the Riverdale series, and the IMDb synopsis says it’s set during a zombie invasion.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2967192/?ref_=nm_flmg_dr_2

The limo driver was played by Steve Vernon. He did some voice work for Bubblegum Crisis (anime) and Genesis Survivor Gaiarth, as well as a handful of shorts and movies way down on the cast list.

Essential Playlist:

Classic Creek Critiques:

Cindy: I just realized last night, after watching Mitch conversing with Dawson in the tree fort, that they have such a great bond. In all the shows past, Dawson and Mitch get on so well together. I think that this issue has never been hit on with discussions. Being too consumed with J/P or J/J or J/D or D/J or ?/?, much of the "little" things get missed. I think James (Dawson) and (?) Mitch portray the father/son relation so well. It makes the scenes quite beleivable. It's nice to see a father and son so close, when in real

life, you really don't see much at all.

sky: I LOVED that seen with Dawson and his Father. It was especially nice to see

a father speak of what it's like love his child.

Mal P reviews but no one is around: Hi everyone! Sorry about this, but I'm hit with three major assignments, two group project meetings to organise and about 200 pages of reading. After watching

the episode, I have about 40 minutes to sleep, so alas this one shall have to be a little short :)

Dawson/Gretchen - As always, fascinating to the upteenth degree. His confusion and uncertainty over Gretchen's decision to seek a job in Boston as opposed to near his college in California was thoroughly endearing. He looked so hurt, almost like a little boy when Gretchen told him the news. But I'm glad he had enough stamina in him to fight it out with Gretchen and achieve a calm, a peace with her that so many (*cough* Pacey and Joey *cough*) other relationships struggle to do as they must part in the final

year of high school. They do realise that their lives are headed in different directions, but are willing to enjoy and love each other in the moment. That takes strength and courage - but perhaps, just perhaps, they are so comfortable with the notion of seperating because they are not as in love with each other as some? Something to think about, especially in regards to next weeks episode.

I'm glad Dawson has overcome his issues with having a baby so late in their families development. He not only seemed genuinely happy for his parents, but enthused himself. His talk with Mitch on the tree house (?) brought a big smile to my face... that's the kind of talk I wish I had with my own father (as much as I love my dad, he and I just aren't the open type). I guess that's what this show is all about... showing what life could be. And I guess that's why we fight over it so much, why we want this couple, and that couple, despite silly writing, despite silly storylines and bad editing... it's because we wish to see ourselves in those scenes.

I was a little dissapointed that the so-called big issues raised in Dawson and Gretchen's relationship weren't covered this week, like his feelings for Joey. I suppose that's for next week, the "sweeps" opener.

I was quite surprised to see Dawsons uncomfortable, but tolerant attitude towards Joey as she talked about sex. One might have thought he would have run screaming from the room, but he showed tremendous degree of understanding and I got the feeling he was going to ask Joey if there was

anything wrong between her and Pacey... that is before he was interrupted with the little, unimportant news that he now had a little sister *wink*

The baby was so beautiful! Awww, I wanna be a dad! <g> One big happy family. My God, Dawsons going to be approaching 40 by the time this kid leaves for college. Amazing.

Joey/Pacey - I could understand the way she'd react to finding out she was late. To have all your hopes and dreams that you've worked so hard for, and finally *earned*, come crashing down around you because of something that you could have controlled, must have been one hell of shell-shock. Joey is

someone who lashes out when she's scared or angry... and boy did she do that with Bessie. I don't doubt the fact that the moment got to her, all the baby shower "ordeal", all the framed pictures of what the future could be like… but boy, was she harsh, and cruel to Bessie! I suppose Bessie too had a right to lash back at Joey, but then again, she knows how much Joey's scared. I'm glad that both of them made up later on in the episode though, in a touching scene. Joey is right, what Bessie has done in her life is extraordinary. Create a wonderful family, a house full of love and a successful business. Don't be surprised if Bessie is living the high-life before she's 40 if she decides to expand. I was surprised Bessie hadn't known Joey was having sex though. I mean, surely she must have had suspicions aroused when Joey continually slept over at Gretchen's house??

You know, I never got the feeling that Joey and Gretchen were friends, especially after the whole "lying" episode. But wow, talk about stone cold tonight! They were eyeing each other suspiciously and... well, I just didn't get a feeling of intimacy. Maybe it's because of the whole "Dawson" thing, Joey being the ex, Gretchen being the current etc. Anyway, I'm glad that Gretchen was there for Joey, she really is a class

act. I was quite surprised at Joey's self-deprecation, not only in that scene with Gretchen but with Bessie as well. So rare an act by Joey. I felt very sorry for her as she juggled the problems of her boyfriend and

herself... contrasting with Dawson and Gretchen's line about putting someone elses needs first or your own.

It's quite ironic that Joey couldn't tell Dawson anything about sex, and now she's all willing to share. It was a little tactless coming at this time… but I'm glad she was supportive of both Dawson and Gretchen and their relationship. Perhaps she sees something in it, honesty, that she wishes to see survive... if only to show that it can be done. Her line about sex being not all it's cracked upto be rang very true... it really does echo and magnify the problems in a relationship as it's so often used to disguise them. I'm really sorry that Joey in a way regrets losing her virginity, that shouldn't be one's first time, although more often than not it is the case. Maybe one day down the line, she'll look back on her teenage years and be glad she lost it to someone she at least loved.

Her phone call to Pacey did show a tremendous amount of tension. This relationship has hit a wall. While I find it odd that it dissolved so rapidly, this is Dawsons Creek, and come on, surely you knew it wouldn't be forever? Pacey's lie in not wanting to tell Joey anything about his problems... the look on Joey's face was heartbreaking. Poor girl. Her hearts going to be broken by all this, and I'm not going to be a happy camper. Note the line she said to Pacey on the phone "I miss you". Self-referential really... she misses the old Pacey that put others problems before his own. He's gone, he's starting to grow up and forge his own path. I'm just sad Joey has to be in the way of it.

Jack/Tobey - I found it a little dull. I don't think I've ever found a storyline that has been so... dull! Perhaps it's because Jack and Tobey have absolutely no chemistry in my opinion. But still, poor Tobey, being bashed because he is gay is a terrible thing to happen, and highlights the problems teenagers have to go through in this day and age. I'm glad Jack was there to support him, he's a great guy.

That's it from me guys, back to my ball and chain (the word processor). A 7 out of 10 for a fairly decent episode. Next week's looks like a scorcher! I can't wait, I've been waiting for drama like that for a long, long time now. I'm sorry Joey's going to be hurt though...

El Parison asks: pacey and joey. in your opinion rhey stay toghether in the end of dawson's creek

2PacAlypse says: I hope so

Alice responds: I don't hope it.. We will get the happy ending... dawson and joey together. !

2PacAlypse replies: the happy ending would be pacey and joey stay together

philou.meresse says: I hope Pacey and Joey will stay together ! Because, Pacey & Joey =

True Love!

John Hardin asks: First off, how many more times do we need to see Jen drinking and lamenting. On top of that, drinking periously close to water. Enough already.

Secondly, good for Joey. Pacey is an idiot. Self pity filled, yet with no intention of making it better. He's right she does deserve better. (Unfortunately, in the coming attractions, it looked like Joey was trying to make amends with this fool.)

Third, Dawson, listen to Gretchen. You ARE still in high school. She's heading towards middle aged. You've still got an ET doll in your room and she's had a miscarriage. The disparage in this situation is frightening. Jack finally made a real move. About time. Truthfully, he's about the only character acting like a real person would.

Mak replies: Hey now...easy there trigger...24 is hardly middle aged...

Paul Lefebvre says: That final bit is RIGHT! Jack's been pussyfooting around the whole gay thing all season long and it's about time he make "some" sort of move, regardless of which direction it's in, to get the character going, out of the shadows and into the limelight. Lets just hope the whole situation doesn't go mushy and the writers gloss it over so much so as to please the advertisers and lose any sense of story in the process.

Tracy Colavito says: I just watched the Prom episode I read in a news article that Tobey and Jack's was more then 5 seconds long, umm what I saw was more like a 1-2 second kiss. I guess the censors got to it before it could air I have to say that I am a little disappointed, but it was still a romantic kiss but it is a HUGE step for the character of Jack, for Dawson's Creek and for primetime television

PJ Browning says: I timed it, it was 4 seconds.

Mal P replies: You sir, are dedicated ;-)

arovo says: hehehe, if he's dedicated then you're a totally stoned junkie ;-) LOL:

Mal P answers: Hard core crack son, get it right ;-)

Howard Rapport says: Go To Hell. That whole scene pissed me off. He's so scared, and he can't accept that fact that Joey loves the side of Pacey that no one else sees. DAMNIT!

Maureen answers: i believe it was "you can go to hell"..... but it was great!!!!!

Gigi5423 says: the was fabulous

DREWELMO says: I have been watching Dawson's Creek from the very first episode. Over these past few years I have become, I guess you could say emotionally attached, to the characters. I would definately say that Pacey was by far my favortie character not only on the show but on any show. His character always seemed so genuine. When the Joey, Pacey romance started my admiration to him only

increased. Thier chemistry was incredible and let's face it he bought her a wall :o) Then all of a sudden Pacey has turned from a normal average guy to this incredibly insecure moody person. It's like they hired someone off the street who knew nothing about the show to write his character. This past season I have watched the downfall of one of the best characters on television. Tonight was the absolute breaking point for me. Why do they want Pacey to be a screw up? I thought the whole point of his character was to prove people like his family and his teachers wrong. But apparently they would rather have him not graduate, get arrested and ruin everyone's prom.What are the writer's on this show thinking. They wonder why the ratings are down Well maybe if they added just a little bit of happiness, people might actually like the show. I have no idea what point I'm trying to make. I just needed to get this out of my system because it really bugged me. So if you actually read this whole thing, Thanks

name says: i agree with ya fully!! I mean, dawson's too much of a 'nice-guy' and I don't like him.

arovo answers: because the writers and producers of the show are screw-ups. they can't reflect good characters because they didn't have that experience, so most of the characters aren't. they'll tend on the side of depicting miserable characters, instead of characters who overcome and lead successful lives.

wasn't the actor who played jen's father one of the writers or was that rumor? the fact is the strength and value of a man is not based on how much shit he can orgasm into (that's the worthless man, aka the producers of the show) but it's based on other things, and these folks just don't got it.

Steph answers: They made Pacey out to be a miserable wretch because they could think of no other way to, seemingly or actually, get Joey and Dawson back together. And the name of the show IS DAWSON'S Creek. Too bad, tho, as Pacey and Joey were quite cute together---once!

Jen replies: I totally agree with you. I started watching Dawson's Creek because of Pacey. Joey and Pacey have great chemistry and I don't like where I see this going. For all of you in favor of Dawson and Joey, sorry. I don't want to see them get back together. Just my opinion.

asmo answers: Dawson is my hero...can you imagine having a friend that was so 'nice-guy?' We would all be damn lucky to. I don't know why you guys think Pacey is being betrayed as a moody loser...I liked him more than ever during the prom episode, because when he was telling Joey when they were sitting down about how he feels so worthless next to her, and he's not good enough etc. he was being so genuine...he never feeds anyone a line...he honestly feels that way, and honestly feels that she deserves more than him...pretty admirable if you ask me. I mean, obviously he has major self-worth/self-esteem problems or whatever, but his good nature shines through...in a way, him and Dawson are quite alike.

Mak responds: I agree, for the most part. I feel like they did the same thing to Dawson's character. The first time in years that I have seen the old D is when he gave J the money to go to college. Why do they want to ruin the characters we love??? This whole prom thing left me very disappointed in Pacey....

Sweetie143823 says: I completely agree with you. I love Pacey, and feel genuinely sorry for him. I know what it feels like to be living in someone's shadow. However, I believe he is completely handling his feelings the wrong way. Rather than so hastily breaking up with Joey, he should have been talking to her all along about his feelings, so that they could work together to help him. I think this situation proves once again how important communication is in a relationship. Pacey is going to regret his decision. I can guarantee that.

Thanks:

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